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Ex-Minister Al Carns Considers Labour Leadership Bid Pending Burnham’s Vision

Former defence minister Al Carns awaits Andy Burnham's economics speech before deciding on a Labour leadership challenge, emphasizing the need for a clear vision and plan. Defence budget concerns and funding debates remain central.

·4 min read
A man with short white hair is wearing an open-neck white shirt and sitting on a red sofa in a TV studio. There is a photographic backdrop behind him illustrating the heatwave, with a woman in summer clothes and a backpack.

Leadership Consideration

Former defence minister Al Carns has indicated that a forthcoming major economics speech by Andy Burnham will influence his decision on whether to challenge the Labour leadership favourite.

The Labour MP for Birmingham Selly Oak expressed his desire to hear "really clear and concise outcomes" outlining Burnham's vision for the country over the next decade.

"We need to see a vision, we need to see the plan because unfortunately a vision without a plan is a dream," he said.
"What I would like to see is where do we want to be by 2029 and where do we want to be by 2034-35."

Carns elaborated on the kind of goals he expects to hear:

"Is it the healthiest nation in Europe, is it adding a trillion pounds onto our GDP, is national security important, how do we get the next generation to have a better deal than the last generation et cetera, et cetera."
"And then a plan to deliver it, and it doesn't need to be the detail but it needs to be there.
Let's see how that lands, let's see how much that pulls everybody together."

Speaking to BBC Politics Midlands, Carns stated:

"I'm not going to start jumping up and down until I've had a look."

To enter any leadership contest, Carns would need to secure nominations from 81 Labour MPs as well as endorsements from Labour affiliates such as trade unions.

Other prominent figures, including Wes Streeting and Darren Jones, have already ruled out running against Burnham, as momentum builds behind the former Greater Manchester Mayor.

Defence Budget

Carns resigned as Armed Forces Minister earlier this month citing concerns over the defence budget, an issue expected to be critical for the next prime minister.

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The government plans to announce its Defence Investment Plan ahead of the Nato summit scheduled for 7 July, despite the resignation of Sir Keir Starmer.

Carns identified defence as one of the "key factors" he will be evaluating in Burnham's speech, emphasizing:

"It's much broader than just defence, bombs, bullets and battleships, it's actually about national resilience."

He also expressed his opposition to cutting welfare spending to fund defence:

"I think the premise of the question is welfare over warfare - a pound off a nurse to give it to a soldier? And I just don't agree with that premise," he said.
"I actually think there's a far broader strategy across all the government departments to make it more productive and indeed shave 10% off... by actually enhancing our standards across the country."

Neil Shastri-Hurst, Conservative MP for Solihull West and Shirley, shared his party's perspective on funding defence:

"We've been very clear, we think the money should come from the welfare state," he said.
"The welfare state should be there to protect the most vulnerable but it shouldn't be there as a better alternative to going out to work.
So we would reintroduce the two-child benefit cap, we would be cutting that welfare bill - at the moment the defence budget is a fifth of what we spend on welfare."
Neil Shastri-Hurst, a man with short black hair, glasses, a multi-coloured tie and a suit, stands and speaks in the House of Commons.
Image caption, Neil Shastri-Hurst said the Conservatives would look at the welfare system to fund defence

Dawn Husemann, Reform UK group leader on Shropshire Council, suggested alternative funding sources for defence:

"We've already committed to [spending] 3.5% [of GDP] by 2035 on defence spending which is incredibly important, we pull our weight on the world's stage and we see that as a floor not a ceiling."
"Spending is about political choices and those choices at the moment are net zero, they are benefits for non-British people.
We need to be looking at that because there are tens of millions that could be used there, and we need to actually utilise our resources for drilling."
Dawn has short grey blonde hair and is wearing a fuchsia pink shirt with a navy and green tweed patterned suit jacket on top
Image caption, Dawn Husemann said money could be taken from net zero and the welfare system for defence

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  • Ministers support Burnham as Labour MPs split over possible contest for leadership
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